Wesley Clark on Seder On Sundays 9-23

i dont like monday's...

when he swore a legions to sister hillary i started to look at him with a pig's eye....and too remember he is working for general electric...so you know they got to his paycheck....

US Blames Iran for Casualties from Its Own Attacks

The Bush administration continues to assert that EFPs are provided by the Iranian government, despite numerous discoveries by U.S. forces of workshops manufacturing such devices in Iraq.

On April 8, Sadr issued a statement urged the Iraqi army and police to stop cooperating with the United States and told his guerrilla fighters to concentrate on pushing U.S. forces out of the country.

Thus it requires no Iranian hand to explain the escalation of the conflict between the Mahdi Army and the U.S. military that accounts for the changing pattern of U.S. casualties in Baghdad.

will be broadcast on cspan-2 starting at noon.

i was surprised to read a new york times article about the iranian president at columbia and the biggest protest organizer is StandWithMe an israeli advocacy group. based on the news to day i would have expected a bunch of freepers.

i just hit the part of yesterdays podcast where sam is talking about this modification of a traditional american value.

CIA running black propaganda operation against Iran, Syria and Lebanon, officials say

Some intelligence sources more wary of covert Pentagon operations

The Central Intelligence Agency has received approval at least twice in the last several years to conduct an “information war” against several countries in the Middle East, including Iran, Lebanon and Syria, according to current and former intelligence officials.

In addition, the Bush Administration has been running operations out of the Defense Department that are not subject to Congressional oversight, intelligence sources say. These programs appear murkier, and have included support for an alleged terrorist group in Iran.

A recent ABC News report revealed that President George W. Bush had signed a presidential finding giving the CIA the authority to conduct “non-lethal” covert operations against Iran. Former and current intelligence sources tell RAW STORY, however, that there have been “at least two” presidential findings over the past few years which have empowered the agency to run an “open-secret” information war against Iranian interests, mainly leveraging resources and assets “within the United States and France.”

Iran 'accused of attacks in Iraq to bolster US strategy'

The Bush administration may be highlighting accusations that the Iranian government is behind attacks in Iraq in order to strengthen its hand in preparing for military strikes on Iran, according to a leading British think-tank.

The UK and US governments have frequently accused Iran of aiding militant groups in Iraq who are attacking coalition forces. However, the report said that "despite efforts by the Bush administration to confirm the strength of evidence presented, doubt still surrounds the case against Iran, particularly with regard to the degree of direct involvement of the Iranian leadership.

"Whatever the true extent and nature of Iranian military action in Iraq, few independent analysts believe Tehran is playing a decisive role in the sectarian warfare and insurgency," said the report.

More Bad Intelligence on Iran and Iraq

This week the White House made a big show of declassifying intelligence alleging that in 2005 al-Qaeda considered using Iraq as a base to launch terrorist attacks on the United States. The White House didn't bother to mask the reason for the disclosure — to put pressure on the Democrats to stop trying to impose a date for a withdrawal from Iraq. Meanwhile, ABC News reported that the White House recently ordered the CIA to destabilize the Iranian regime.

Both cases show how the Administration is still trying to manipulate intelligence to further its strategic goals.

quite a group....young dems made sense the rest all spewing the usual talking points....most posters were "dont bomb iran" so i dont know..i turned to ask some guy taping were i could listen to his taping....oh Lord!!! Fox news he says to me....that was it for me!!!

Iran most active in countering terror

A recent statement issued by the UN Security Council (UNSC) says Iran is the most active country in countering terrorism.

Bush doesn't want detente. He wants to attack Iran

Although the US administration's current priority is Iraq, it has not given up on Iran. Silently, stealthily, unseen by cameras, the war on Iran has begun. Many sources confirm that the US has increased its aid to armed movements among the ethnic minorities that make up about 40% of Iran's population. ABC News reported in April that the US had secretly assisted the Baluchi group Jund al-Islam (Soldiers of Islam), responsible for a recent attack that killed 20 Revolutionary Guards. According to an American Foundation report, US commandos have operated inside Iran since 2004.

CIA mock-execution of Iran diplomat

Jalal Sharafi's psychiatrist says the diplomat is constantly reliving the trauma of his torture, including mock executions by his US and Iraqi captors.

ABC And The IED's From Iran That Were Made In The UK

it was discovered that the new, deadly IED's were using a British design that had been stupidly given to the IRA by British intelligence and then passed around various terror groups the IRA were allied with. Major egg on faces - story dropped.

just curious

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Ahem...

LOL

dr probably won't see this post owing to his ichthyophagous safari, but that's okay. I doubt that I'm about to write anything that he doesn't already know.

Our disagreement is less like disagreement and more like teasing a cat with yarn to watch it swat and pounce. We disagree on plenty of the opinions we hold but we agree that we express some pretty good reasons for holding those opinions. That's all anyone can ask of anyone else: Give us a carefully reasoned back story, something better than "Because it's patriotic," and we'll go away happy with the knowledge that you are thinking instead of following the herd.

dr is a good debater. He (and Catharine) seized on my claim that MoveOn is a member of a group (actually two groups, more on that in a moment) that has a track record for less-than-honorable means to their ends. The groups having poor track records are political and, more importantly, human.

My claim was a sidebar during our discussion of the Petraeus/Betray Us advertisement but it was a chink in my argumentative armor, so dr poked a pry bar into the gap and peeled-away at my breastplate. Then he banged on it to peal his success (but I digress in deference to compulsive wordplay).

The only difference between my claim and dr's clever misdirection of it is that I stated that a member of a group known for less-than-ethical behavior should remain under suspicion (especially as it grows in size and power), and dr's claim is that I am being unfair if I cannot cite specific instances of unethical behavior committed by the member of the group to justify my continuing suspicion.

He's right, sorta. It's the ol' "innocent until proved guilty" ploy. dr's argument wins out when applied in some discussions; my argument wins out in others (like this one for instance...I keed, I keed).

I dislike the citation of quotes or bromides to support arguments because their use can be twisted to suit almost any application, but I can't resist this one:

One of the Aesop fables has a freezing snake begging the farmer to put the snake in his pocket to warm him up. The farmer obliged the snake only after the snake had promised not to bite him. As soon as the snake had sufficient warmth and strength, it bit the farmer.

"You knew I was a snake when you picked me up."

(Unnamed sources indicate that the snake that bit the farmer had never, ever bit the farmer before.)

ahmadinejad's speech style is real difficult to understand. i don't know whether this is because something is lost in translation or he is intentionally being obtuse by mixing politics and religion.

More Fuzzy Evidence On Iran

Ashtray hardware and Radio Shack electronics. Yeah. This stuff had to come from Iran, all right.

mentos and a diet coke should do the trick...

when they first started trying to prove this point sometime back didn't one of the "weapons" have a made in iran tag, printed in english (for our benefit of course)

Ouch. Nobody better never try *that* at home.

Isn't repetition a lovely device to use against those that are susceptible to suggestion?

"So, Nobody...what's your personal opinion of Ahmadinejad?"

I think that he's genuine. What he says fits the facts. For what reason would Iran be trying to instigate or supply arms so sloppily that they could be traced back to them?

Other than that...I don't think much else is relevent at the moment.

Snuck out to grocery shop b4 it got too hot here.

I am watching Ahmadenajad Dan.

He is mixing alot of religion into his speech.

I don't really like him, he's not a good person, however, I do feel that Iran is being blamed for everything lately. On purpose.

I do know that he is not liked in Iran and the Ayatolla even criticizes him. The young in Iran would like him out. I feel that we should not attack Iran and let the internal politics play out. I would keep an eye on him though. I would not want them to create a nuclear bomb.

Those are my thoughts. Again, I could be wrong but I do not want to see another war started that can be avoided.

"when they first started trying to prove this point sometime back didn't one of the "weapons" have a made in iran tag, printed in english (for our benefit of course)"

In that case if I remember right not only were there made in Iran tags on them and printed in english they were also identified later as U.S. munitions...

The neocons have promoted a bunch of real dimwits into their special intelligence groups...

Homeland Security deputy Jackson resigns

WASHINGTON -- The Homeland Security Department's second-in-command resigned Monday, citing personal financial reasons.

Michael P. Jackson, the department's deputy secretary, has had a major hand in running the large department, particularly in putting in place the current management team. In an e-mail to staff Monday, Jackson said, "The simple truth, however, is that after over five years of serving with the president's team, I am compelled to depart for financial reasons that I can no longer ignore." Jackson's resignation is effective Oct. 26.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/1152AP_Jackson.html

create and have any nuclear anything....WHY?

Senate Source: McConnell 'Inaccurate' on Iraq Kidnapping Surveillance
By Spencer Ackerman - September 24, 2007, 12:22PM

According to a Senate source who requested anonymity, Admiral Mike McConnell was "inaccurate" in his account last week of a FISA Court ruling necessitating a delay in spying on Iraqi insurgents who kidnapped U.S. troops.

http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/004272.php

later!!!

"why should the US be allowed to create and have any nuclear anything...."

Because it allows for wars of conquest.

Because it makes lots of money for people that are already rolling in it.

Because it's in the bible.

Because they're shiny.

Because they're phallic symbols.

Sorry...Can't think of a good reason for anyone to have those types of weapons.

JERUSALEM - The prosecutor's office ordered police to launch a criminal investigation into Prime Minister Ehud Olmert's purchase of a Jerusalem home well below market value, the Justice Ministry said Monday.

Israel's state comptroller, a government watchdog, has already investigated allegations that Olmert bought the house from a Jerusalem developer in the upscale German Colony neighborhood at $325,000 under market value, raising suspicions of fraud and bribery. The sale took place before Olmert was prime minister.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/20956446/for/cnbc

Let me go see my handsome dentist..

http://goleft.tv/view.asp?v=550

Submitted by Nobody on Mon, 09/24/2007 - 12:41pm.

I think that he's genuine. What he says fits the facts

------------------------

You mean like this?---

"I have no intention of arguing about the Holocaust. But, does it not stand to reason that some victorious countries of World War II intended to create an alibi on the basis of which they could continue keeping the defeated nations of World War II indebted to them. Their purpose has been to weaken their morale and their inspiration in order to obstruct their progress and power."---- letter from Ahmadinejad to German Chancellor Angela Merkel in July 2006.

Iran 81mm Mortar Story: Twists, Turns, and Eating Crow

It was just yesterday I received an email indicating my assertion the Iranian 81mm mortar story—part and parcel of the neocon effort to finger Iran for killing U.S. soldiers in Iraq—was in error, as it appeared at first glance indeed an Iranian death merchant manufactured 81mm mortar shells, thus debunking my debunking of the neocon effort, not that it particularly matters as the neocons will bomb the smithereens out of Iran regardless of the transparency of their propaganda. In short, I ate a healthy serving of crow, and then set about removing my original post and adding a retraction.

But wait a minute. Not so fast.

I'm even more curious about why Wes is ignoring the broader war on terror. Pakistan is the one rumored to have delivered nuclear technology and finished weapons to Iran after all.

He also predisposes a lot about the Iran/Iraq bond. I don't think it exists really except in back channels and some family relationships. They had a brutal war just not too long ago. I don't think the people of Iraq want to give their oil to Iran any more than give it to America. I think they want to sell it themselves to the highest bidder.

This sounded the same as what Hillary said. She has no intentions of actually getting out of the business of being an Imperialistic power. I think we could go a lot further if we had better relationships around the world. This isn't helping imho.

guys all got fired by the Bushies cuz they were gay...

Why is the Iranian Ammunition Industries Group's webpage in English?

Now for what possible reason would an Iranian company have a website in English but not in their native language, nor in the language of the majority of their neighbors? It makes no sense!

Clearly, the lack of a Farsi version of this page http://www.diomil.ir simultaneous with the existence of a Farsi version of this page http://www.qodstv.ir/ indicates that something is going on here.

yes, you too can put a howitzer in your backyard. i suppose having visited that site my ip will be monitored for the rest of my life.

Bush's New Iran Policy - No Evidence for IED Charge

For 18 months now, the George W. Bush administration has periodically raised the charge that Iran is supplying anti-coalition forces in Iraq with arms.

But in the past, high administration officials have always admitted that they have no real evidence to support it. Now, they are going further. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice told reporters on her current Middle Eastern trip, "I think there is plenty of evidence that there is Iranian involvement with these networks that are making high-explosive IEDs [improvised explosive devices] and that are endangering our troops, and that's going to be dealt with."

However, Rice failed to provide any evidence of official Iranian involvement.

Time for a new computer LOL

"Explosively formed penetrators" rebranded UK shells, and not Iranian?

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do they actually try and group callers? the current set of callers all seem to be of one mind set and it all seems focused on seething hate towards iran.

Bombs From Iran...Umm, Made In Uk...

Eight British soldiers killed during ambushes in Iraq were the victims of a highly sophisticated bomb first used by the IRA, The Independent on Sunday can reveal.

The soldiers, who were targeted by insurgents as they travelled through the country, died after being attacked with bombs triggered by infra-red beams. The bombs were developed by the IRA using technology passed on by the security services in a botched "sting" operation more than a decade ago.

This contradicts the British government's claims that Iran's Revolutionary Guard is helping Shia insurgents to make the devices.

that the old "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" philosophy that makes you want to find reasons to like the president of Iran?

I, too, want to hear what he has to say. I, too, think his country is being negatively slanted by the media. But let's not put a halo about his head just yet.

Naw but you can be sure that there's a phone bank busy somewhere and people are lined up to make those calls...script in hand.

just saw your post. thanks.

speech at columbia will be covered on cspan-2 at around 1:30

Not at all...That sort of logic has never worked for me.

They way it usually works is "the enemy of my enemy is probably also my enemy".

Objectively, Iran gains nothing by sending arms into Iraq as it only prolongs the conflict and works counter to their stated objective of the U.S. leaving Iraq.

like George Bush is sincere!

I don't trust him just like I don't trust Bush.

He smiles too much!

I don't like what is happening in Iran, however, the Iranians must deal with this. I don't think the Iranians have done everything they are blamed for, however I do think they are doing something.

Do I want the US to go to war with them? No. It would be a fool's war.

from the cspan maing page:

· Rep. Hunter (R-CA) Seeks to Deny Federal Money to University

· New York Considering Reducing Financial Support for University

· Mitt Romney: Iranian Pres. Shouldn't Have Been Allowed in U.S.

"Oh Boy — The White House Calls Obama Intellectually Lazy"

"A senior White House official has offered this critique of Barack Obama:

As for Obama, a senior White House official said the freshman senator from Illinois was "capable" of the intellectual rigor needed to win the presidency but instead relies too heavily on his easy charm.
"It's sort of like, 'that's all I need to get by,' which bespeaks sort of a condescending attitude towards the voters," said the official, speaking on condition of anonymity. "And a laziness, an intellectual laziness.

Is there anything more to say?"

Remind me to stay absolutely grim in your presence...

You know a politician that doesn't?...

Podhoretz Granted Secret Access To Lobby Bush On ‘The Case For Bombing Iran’
Norman Podhoretz, the “patriarch of neoconservatism,” recently published a book entitled “World War IV: The Long Struggle Against Islamofascism,” staunchly supporting the Iraq war and pushing for war with Iran. In June, Podhoretz published a controversial piece in Commentary magazine titled “The Case for Bombing Iran.”

The Politico reports today that President Bush has been listening to Podhoretz’s radical agenda, recently enlisting Podhoretz to discuss his views on Iran. In a meeting that “was not on the president’s public schedule,” Bush and Karl Rove “sat listening to Norman Podhoretz for roughly 45 minutes at the White House”:

Rove was silent throughout, though he took notes. The president listened diligently, Podhoretz said as he recounted the conversation months later, but he “didn’t tip his hand.”

“I did say to [the president], that people ask: Why are you spending all this time negotiating sanctions? Time is passing. I said, my friend [Robert] Kagan wrote a column which he said you were giving ‘futility its chance.’ And both he and Karl Rove burst out laughing.

“It struck me,” Podhoretz added, “that if they really believed that there was a chance for these negotiations and sanctions to work, they would not have laughed. They would have got their backs up and said, ‘No, no, it’s not futile, there’s a very good chance.’”

President Bush has loyally supported Podhoretz’s agenda in the past. In 2004, he bestowed the Presidential Medal of Freedom — the nation’s highest civilian honor — on Podhoretz, calling him a “fierce intellectual man” with “fine writing and a “great love for our country.”

Today, Podhoretz’s calls for bombing Iran are being echoed in the administration. According to Newsweek, Vice President Cheney considered a plan to allow Israel to conduct missile strikes against Iran “in an effort to draw a military response from Iran, which could in turn spark a U.S. offensive against targets in the Islamic Republic.”

Podhoretz has argued that “if we were to bomb the Iranians as I hope and pray we will…we’ll unleash a wave of anti-Americanism all over the world that will make the anti-Americanism we’ve experienced so far look like a lovefest.” By enlisting Podhoretz’s advice, President Bush is demonstrating that there isn’t any idea too radical for him to consider.

http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/24/podhoretz-bush-meeting/

what a hoot. this from a c student.

Missed the show yesterday...my son took me to the Jets/Fish game. Went to switch on the car radio to WWRL to catch Sammer & what do I hear? A fucking vitamin infomercial!

You're disgusting, Green. You can't even get your lineup on the so-called Flagship Station?

Incompetence...sheer fucking incompetence!

Hmmm? Wonder if your namesake show -- what's it called...Green Slimes The Left, eh -- gets broadcast in its entirety?

I was watching a show the other day that had nothing to do with politics. There was a woman speaking and she had a constant smile on her face. She would speak and after finishing what she had to say you could see the corners of her mouth pull up into a smile.

I thought to myself, I don't trust a thing this woman has to say. After listening for awhile I was drawn to her face and the way she smiled and focused on that and heard nothing of what she said.

I got that same feeling today with Ahmadenijad and I get that same feeling everytime I watch Bush when he is speaking.

And yes, all politicians smile, but not all smile in that way.

More than 20 retired generals speak out against Iraq war. “In op-ed pieces, interviews and TV ads, more than 20 retired U.S. generals have broken ranks with the culture of salute and keep it in the family. Instead, they are criticizing the commander in chief and other top civilian leaders who led the nation into what the generals believe is a misbegotten and tragic war.” Most “were political conservatives who had voted for George W. Bush,” but “they felt betrayed by Bush and his advisers.”

http://www.juancole.com/2007/09/iraq-relents-on-blackwater-bush-to-ask.h...

Some animals, dogs for instance, (bears and monkeys, too?), see a smile and mistake it for a sign of aggression.

Something to think about..

Greenspan: Because Of Oil, Saddam Was ‘Far More Important To Get Out Than Bin Laden’
In his new memoir, The Age of Turbulence, former Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan writes that he is “saddened that it is politically inconvenient to acknowledge what everyone knows: the Iraq war is largely about oil.” Greenspan later clarified his remark in an interview with the Washington Post, saying that while oil was not “the administration’s motive,” it was “essential” to remove Saddam Hussein because of it.

In an interview with Charlie Rose last week, Greenspan went even further in his defense of the Iraq war, saying it was “far more important to get” Saddam Hussein “out than bin Laden”:

ALAN GREENSPAN: People do not realize in this country, for example, how tenuous our ties to international energy are. That is, we on a daily basis require continuous flow. If that flow is shut off, it causes catastrophic effects in the industrial world. And it’s that which made him far more important to get out than bin Laden.

Watch it:

Greenspan’s continued belief that invading Iraq was the right decision flies in the face of the evidence.

In March 2003, when the U.S. first invaded Iraq, the price of oil was roughly US$35 a barrel. Just two weeks ago, however, oil prices reached “above US$80 a barrel for the first time ever.”

Additionally, the rate of international terrorism has increased significantly since the invasion of Iraq. In 2003, there were a total of 193 acts of international terrorism. In 2006, however, 14,000 terrorist attacks occurred, almost half of which occurred in Iraq.

By any metric, the decision to invade Iraq and take the focus off bin Laden has been a disastrous strategic choice.

http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/24/greenspan-bin-laden/

Thom Hartmann is pretty interesting today. Ya all should listen. Our government now wants to take away the Freedom of Information Act.

they use to supplement manpower in their wargame scenerios against Iran...Tactical nukes...See..the cover story will be that it's radiation from the destroyed nuke plants...Even though Iran hasn't produced enough material to do squat with...People will buy it out of pure ignorance and kneejerk hatred built up after decades of propoganda...Can't wait till they start putting up the stories about Iranians dumping babies out of their incubators...

US ex-generals reject Iran strike

Three former high-ranking American military officers have warned against any military attack on Iran.

They said such action would have "disastrous consequences" for security in the Middle East and also for coalition forces in Iraq.

Iran: A War Is Coming

Like Bush's and Blair's claim that they had irrefutable evidence that Saddam Hussein was deploying weapons of mass destruction, the "evidence" lacks all credibility. Iran has a natural affinity with the Shi'ite majority of Iraq, and has been implacably opposed to al-Qaeda, condemning the 9/11 attacks and supporting the United States in Afghanistan. Syria has done the same. Investigations by the New York Times, the Los Angeles Times and others, including British military officials, have concluded that Iran is not engaged in the cross-border supply of weapons. General Peter Pace, chairman of the US Joint Chiefs of Staff, has said no such evidence exists.

their schedule seems to be changing in real time today.

Editor of college paper that ran 'f***' Bush editorial says he'd run it again
David Edwards and Jason Rhyne
Published: Monday September 24, 2007

The editorial board of a Colorado State University student newspaper didn't mince words criticizing President Bush following a free speech debate sparked by the recent tasing of a Florida student.

"Taser this FUCK BUSH," the entirety of a four-word column read in the student-run Rocky Mountain Collegian.

"We felt that maybe four words were more impactful than 250," said Dave McSwane, the paper's editor, in a segment shown on CNN's American Morning. The wording of the editorial was agreed upon by the Collegian's seven-member board.

"Our intentions weren't 'hey let's really upset the community," McSwane said. "Our intentions were let's get college students talking about freedom of speech."

Asked by CNN's John Roberts if the wording of the piece could be characterized as vulgar or sophomoric, he said "wouldn't entirely disagree."

"Free speech, you know, when you say things like this you don't expect everyone to agree with it," the editor added.

"While we understand that the editorial...is upsetting and offensive to many people," a statement from Colorado State University read, "CSU is prohibited by law from censoring or regulating the content of its student media publications."

McSwane has been asked to appear before the university's Board of Student Communications to defend his job, and says he "absolutely" stands by the piece.

"We wanted people to understand that free speech is something we should talk about," he said. "We felt that this campus, for one reason or another, has been really apathetic. Too quiet. We felt that the best way to spark that dialogue was to exercise it ourselves."

Video at link

http://rawstory.com//news/2007/Fourword_editorial_Taser_this...fuck_Bush...

Scott Ritter has been saying Bush wants to go to war with Iran for the last 2 yrs. He is on Randi's show every now & then.

I like what CU President is saying about Free Speech.

toniD guffaws at one of my Greek jokes.

Israeli air strike did not hit nuclear facility, intelligence officials say Larisa Alexandrovna
Published: Monday September 24, 2007

Attack said spawned from chemical weapons disaster

Israel did not strike a nuclear weapons facility in Syria on Sept. 6, instead striking a cache of North Korean missiles, current and former intelligence officials say.

American intelligence sources familiar with key events leading up to the Israeli air raid explained tell RAW STORY that what the Syrians actually had were North Korean No-Dong missiles, possibly located at a site in either the city of Musalmiya in the northern part of Syria or further south around the city of Hama.

While reports have alleged the US provided intelligence to Israel or that Israel shared their intelligence with the US, sources interviewed for this article believe that neither is accurate.

By most accounts of intelligence officials, both former and current, Israel and the US both were well aware of the activities of North Korea and Syria and their attempts to chemically weaponize the No-Dong missile (above right). It therefore remains unclear why an intricate story involving evidence of a Syrian nuclear weapons program and/or enriched uranium was put out to press organizations.

The North Korean missiles -- described as "legacy" by one source and "older generation" by another -- were not nuclear arms.

http://rawstory.com//news/2007/Intelligence_officials_say_Israel_receive...

On July 10, 2007, Rudolph W. Giuliani announced the "line-up" of his foreign policy team, which included Norman Podhoretz, Ed Lasky wrote in the American Thinker. Podhoretz "has argued for a forthright approach toward Iran and Islamic extremism. Republicans increasingly measure their leaders by this yardstick: will they appease Islamic extremists or defend America from them?"

Podhoretz will serve as a member of the Senior Foreign Policy Advisory Board.

That is a nice photo of H.

Brzezinski: U.S. in danger of 'stampeding' to war with Iran

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Former national security adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski likened U.S. officials' saber rattling about Iran's alleged nuclear ambitions to similar statements made before the start of the Iraq war.

"I think the administration, the president and the vice president particularly, are trying to hype the atmosphere, and that is reminiscent of what preceded the war in Iraq," Brzezinski told CNN's "Late Edition" on Sunday.

But Henry Kissinger, the former national security adviser and secretary of state under President Nixon, appeared not to doubt Iran's alleged ambitions.

"I believe they are building a capability to build a nuclear bomb," Kissinger told CNN. "I don't think they're yet in a position to build a nuclear bomb, but they may be two or three years away from it."

Earlier this month during a televised speech asserting that U.S. troops should not be immediately withdrawn from Iraq, President Bush said, "Iran would benefit from the chaos and would be encouraged in its efforts to gain nuclear weapons and dominate the region."

However, Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said in an interview that aired Sunday on CBS' "60 Minutes" that "insecurity in Iraq is detrimental to our interests."

Brzezinski also disapproved of Bush's statement.

"When the president flatly asserts they are seeking nuclear weapons, he's overstating the facts," he said. "We are suspicious. We have strong suspicions, but we don't have facts that they are."

Brzezinski, who served under President Jimmy Carter, said he is not sure how to interpret Iran's intentions. Iran has insisted its nuclear program is intended solely for peaceful purposes.

"I think it's quite possible that they are seeking weapons or positioning themselves to have them, but we have very scant evidence to support that," he said. "And the president of the United States, especially after Iraq, should be very careful about the veracity of his public assertions."

Brzezinski, who is advising the Democratic presidential campaign of Illinois Sen. Barack Obama, urged American officials to be patient, whatever Tehran's intentions may be.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/09/23/iran.us/index.html

"I think it's important that we end these kinds of attacks on the patriotism of those who serve our country," Clinton said on NBC's "Meet the Press" program.

"This is not a debate about an ad. This is a debate about the direction we should pursue in Iraq."

I personally don't think that Giuliani has a chance in hell of even getting the Republican nomonation.

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believe that he said that?

Caught Red-Handed: Media Backtracks on Iran’s Anti-Israel “Threat”

The effect this misquote has had on American policy towards Iran is undeniable. The majority of 2008 Presidential candidates in both parties have repeatedly mentioned the alleged threat in speeches and interviews, obviously influenced by media reports.

And yet suddenly, after all this hoopla, at least two of the biggest media titans, the BBC and the Associated Press, appear to be backing away from the incorrect “wiped off the map” quotation they’ve been drilling into people’s minds for so long. It’s happening quietly and undemonstratively, but some recent subtle changes in their presentation indicate a tacit acknowledgement of their previous misreporting.

Let alone being Prez.

LINK

They canceled the c-span1 link.

What a bunch of mumbo jumbo. Why is he talking if he's just going to say such mumbo jumbo. This really must be a political show for his home land.

Sen. Clinton Can't Pledge Troop Withdrawal

'We Don't Know What We're Going to Inherit,' Democratic Candidate Says

Democratic presidential candidate Sen. Hillary Clinton, D-N.Y., said this morning that she will not make any pledges regarding a U.S. troop withdrawal from Iraq.

"We don't know what we're going to inherit," she said on ABC News' "This Week with George Stephanopoulos." "None of us do. We don't know what's going to be done in the last 15 months of the Bush-Cheney administration."

Does anyone know how long there has been prayer said before the Senate or Rep. start their sessions????

Ahmadenijad speaking now.

since about the 1950's I believe...Same time as "in god we trust" was added to our currency.

Damm I don't get C-Span 3 - - - Thanks Nobody for the info.

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i use

http://www.cspan.org/watch

and use the standalone wmp links.

http://www.cspan.org/watch/cspan3_rm.asp?Cat=TV&Code=CS3

from 1953 that did not have In God We Trust on it. And the bills from 1957 do have it. So this happened somewhere between 1953-1957.

i'll second that. maybe someone more familiar with the iranian culture and language can weigh in. perhaps its a "yoda" thing where their thinking process is just wired differently.

It's a cultural linguistic style...Framing everything with the religious overtones at the outset...

On edit I'd also point out that similiar styles appear in all religious people...

You dare not ask certain questions...

to bring his questions meanwhile not answering Lee's questions. Both sides are talking to themselves instead of with each other. It's an interesting moment.

At least he's not denying the WWII Holocaust. At least there is a dialog happening. I don't hear him threatening the University outright and I expected worse.

right after 9/11 Iran was working with us to track down Al Qaeda.

*

:)

that will be in their papers. "We love Jews", I love it.

he suggests a vote and let the majority decide. i presume that the numbers are on the side of the palestinians?

.

Bush Admin: We Were Wrong; Privatization Won't Fix Social Security
"Social Security can be made permanently solvent only by reducing the present value of scheduled benefits and/or increasing the present value of scheduled tax increases," a Treasury Department report says.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/2007/09/administration_urges_social_se...

say he believes Israel has a right to exist.

His argument to support terrorists may be a reflection of our own foreign policy debacles of the past (mostly towards the benefit of oil companies btw).

you seem to be the most neutral about iran. is there any truth in what the iranian president is saying about iran has been under attack by u.s. sponsored terrorists?

And OJ is looking for the real killers.

not really...unless you count the fact that the people of Israel by majority also want peace and would likely vote against their own right wing government...

There's quite a bit of evidence of it including the U.S. admitting to sponsoring black ops inside Iran and arming the Mehdi army...I posted one article above...

wtf ok, it's back nevermind.

Marcel (Mangel) Marceau born 3/22/23 – died 9/22/07

IMAGES OF IRAN YOU WILL NOT SEE ON THE MAINSTREAM MEDIA

MoveOn to Pay Full Times Ad Rate

By Kate Phillips

On the issue of an issue that just hasn’t moved on, the liberal activist group MoveOn.org announced this afternoon that, in light of today’s column by The Times’s public editor, Clark Hoyt, it would pay the full advertisement rate of $142,083 for its controversial “General Betray Us?” spot in the A-section of the newspaper nearly two weeks ago.

The print ad itself, appearing on the day that General David Petraeus and Ambassador Ryan Crocker went up to Capitol Hill to begin delivering status reports on the effects of President Bush’s so-called surge in Iraq, generated a lot of condemnation from Republicans — especially former New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani, Senator John McCain and Vice President Dick Cheney. The debate swirled around the general’s testimony throughout the week and beyond, as Republicans demanded that Democrats — lawmakers on the Hill and the presidential candidates — denounce it.

I am back from vacation and willing to say HELLO!

Is that our very own Nobody that I see has returned?

Hya Nobs! Welcome back and where ya been?

that was funny!

we should send the Phelps church to Iran. They don't have homosexuals there and don't tolerate that. The Phelps gang would fit right in!

God has blessed Iran. Perhaps there is something to that religion.

No gays in Iran!

WHOA! Where did you come from...."Deliverance?"

That got a laugh and a groan.

The Bush of Iran!

the no gays sound bite from this guy can only help the cause of gay rights here and in Iran.

islam, differences can run deep. is the flavor is islam the same as or different from the flavor that bin laden and saudi arabia practices?

I needed the vacation amongst other things...

How ya been?

Columbia President To Ahmadinejad: "You Exhibit All The Signs Of A Petty And Cruel Dictator" »

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

New York Times | Sewell Chan | September 24, 2007 09:21 AM

Mr. Bollinger asked Mr. Ahmadinejad: "Mr. President, you exhibit all the signs of a petty and cruel dictator, and so I ask you, and so I ask you, why have women members of the Bahai faith, homosexuals and so many of our academic colleagues become targets of persecution in your country?"

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/09/24/protests-at-columbia-over-i...

bet you didn't even notice I had gone. LOL!

bush a f*tard?

The blog wasn't the same without you but I don't know exactly

what I mean by that....which I am sure will amuse you!

Am I the only one that noticed that he was almost laughing when he said that?

It's a society wide "don't ask, don't tell" policy...To be executing gays as was suggested goes on there then they'd be admitting that they exist...So that's not really a possibility.

when you think about the number of people executed texas, let alone the united states, is iran really that less civilized?

I listened to this after Sunday's show - in search of clarity. Diane Rhem - if you don't know - is a 70 year old woman who has a condition which makes her sound 90. She speaks slow and deliberately. (Once I heard her interview Robert Byrd and double over laughing.) She is in the DC loop and makes an effort at neutrality.
http://www.wamu.org/programs/dr/07/09/19.php#17365
NPR -PODCAST, ARCHIVE AVAILABLE:Diane Rehm-Wednesday September 19, 200 -Iraq and Iran
A discussion on the security situation in Iraq and the looming threat of a possible confrontation with Iran.

Guests
Gen. Wesley Clark, former NATO Supreme Allied Commander and author of "A Time To Lead," "Waging Modern War" and "Winning Modern Wars."

Peter Rodman, Senior Fellow at the Brookings Institution and former Assistant Secretary of Defense for International Security Affairs (2001-07)

Something just came up.

Hell, most things amuse me on one level or another...

Ya ya...evidently I amuse a few people around here as well...

Were you on vacation?

I also have missed RWiley and his limericks!!

He hasn't checked in for awhile. Hope all is well.

Submitted by Peter Dragon on Mon, 09/24/2007 - 3:02pm.
Something just came up.
----------------
...and they accuse me of making cheap jokes.

Do we have enough electricity to kill all the gays in the United States. How long would it take? Men and Women? Would we have to prove it, or just charge them? Would they have to be convicted of being gay?

Actually, I think Iran and the US is one of four remaining countries in the world that have the death penalty...The US is the world leader in executions though...

the "didn't answer" meme is the one they're going to go with...

have done to the msm in the past seven years with their lies and revisionism and propaganda what makes you believe that all the evil things you hear abour iran are really true?

Am I the only woman here?

Speak up ladies!!!

is related to that chick that went before congress and claimed that Iraqis were dumping babies out of incubators...

Canadian Kittens versus American Kittens from “Cute with Chris“.

answer a lot of questions. That takes a lot of credibility from what he was trying to say. Not that he had much credibility. That plus I believe politicians lie made the discussion somewhat just theater.

between the iranian president deflecting questions and changing the subject

and the republicans changing the discussion about the war on iraq to one on the move on ad?

why is it wrong for him to do this but okay for neocons?

Made in Canada for sure!

Umm...What question wasn't answered?...

the DHS for refusing to use the immigration check data base.

You guys are very optimistic.

Submitted by dada on Mon, 09/24/2007 - 1:59am.

I like that. I'm feeling very cynical.

[dr:] "If the Republican Party can be infiltrated 'n taken over by crazed militant fundamentalist-lovin' reactionary revolutionaries, I really don't see why the Democraptic Party can't experience the same kinda sea-change from w/in by actual liberals 'n progressives 'n such-like truck."

The right welcomed the crazy fundies and righty libertarians. They used them, catered to them. Funny how the real conservatives lost control. Kind of justice, in a way. But liberals and progressives are fought against by the corporate Democrats. Except for "lesser of two evils liberals and progressives," tha[t] aren't really liberal or progressive, and who will fall in line and elect anyone who calls themselves a Democrat.

*

You? "Cynical"? Nah, not normally. You're informed. And what you see & read & hear irritates & depresses you.

Just like me. Just like every other thinking person here.

But for the sake of your post above, I'll answer my opening questions, "No, really?"

Nobs nailed it. You should have ended it at: "But liberals and progressives are fought against by the corporat[ists]," editing (as you stated in your later comment), notwithstanding.

Would it be fair to contrast your statement, "'lesser of two evils liberals and progressives,' tha[t] aren't really liberal or progressive," with "a pox on all your houses"?

There ARE those that you describe, but they compose a small minority of self-described "liberals and progressives." You know this.

Rather than "cynical," I think a better word to describe your feelings would be "frustrated."

We all are, dada.

DHS sues Illinois for blocking immigrant crackdown
by Frank James

The Homeland Security Department is suing Illinois to undo a new state law the federal agency says would make it more difficult to enforce the nation's immigration laws.

The law is an amendment to Illinois's “Right to Privacy in the Workplace Act" which would make it impossible, says Homeland Security, for employers to participate in a voluntary federal program many currently use to verify whether new employees are legally entitled to work in the U.S.

Called E-Verify, the Internet program allows employers to transmit to the federal government certain identity information which permits immigration officials to confirm (or not) whether the employees can be legally employed.

About 93 percent of such queries come back either immediately or, if a manual check is necessary, the next day, confirming that an employee is eligible to work in the U.S. The rest are categorized as "tentative non-confirmations."

The employee can decide not to contest the non-confirmation. If he does contest it, Homeland Security will further investigate the matter, but that can take weeks.

Here's where the new Illinois law comes in. It essentially says that until Homeland Security can conduct 99 percent of those investigations within three days, it's illegal for all businesses operating in Illinois to participate in the E-Verify program.

Thus the lawsuit which was filed by the Justice Department on behalf of Homeland Security today.

http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2007/09/dhs_sues_illinoi...

ToniD, I have breasts too :)

which kitten is cuter...

Bronx kitten: "Yo, meow."

Canadian kitten: "Meow, eh?"

Québecois kitten: "Le meow."

I thought I was alone!

i thought everyone knew that.

our Japanese cuteness factor rating is 300% higher than the USA.

Bush official: Obama shows 'intellectual laziness'

More...

http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2007/09/bush_official_ob...

"We have met the enemy, and he is us."

A much needed laugh.

Anyone talking about this? The Rocky Mountain Collegian publishes profanity and expresses a sentiment I think we all understand.

http://media.www.collegian.com/media/storage/paper864/news/2007/09/24/Ne...

When did this happen?...

He's long winded that's for sure and a bit is lost in translation but I don't recall any unanswered questons or changing of the subject.

Of course I've been accused of the same thing when I post too long an answer when someone wants an explicit yes or no...

In case you don't know...asking for an explict yes or no is a tactic used to get a speaker to impeach himself when the subject is complicated...If you answer either yes or no then you're screwed...

A cheap example of how this word game works like this..."Do you like little boys"...

If you answer yes then you're a pervert even if you just mean that kids are ok with you...If you answer no then you're hiding something or a hater of little girls...

Suggested Questions Related to Habeas Corpus:
According to the Defense Department's own records, at least 86% of the men held at Guantanamo Bay were not caught on the battlefield, and many of them were sold to the U.S. military for a bounty. If you were swayed by Senator Kyl or Graham's erroneous statements that these were battlefield captures, are you willing to get the facts straight and tell Senator Specter or Leahy that you will reconsider your vote?
Did you know that the Combatant Status Review Tribunals (currently a detainee's only course to a legal determination) have been called into question by Lieutenant Colonel Stephen Abraham, whose testimony indicates their judgments are predetermined and an insult to the rule of law?
Three retired Judge Advocates General have urged Congress not to strip the courts of habeas corpus jurisdiction. Knowing this change to habeas upsets an established government balance, would you reconsider your vote?
Americans can't expect other countries to treat U.S. detainees better than we treat detainees from their countries. That several hundred Guantanamo detainees have already been released proves that our military made many mistakes. Habeas corpus is an internationally accepted remedy for sorting out which detainees should continue to be held and which should be released. Will you vote to restore habeas corpus to make sure the U.S. has fair procedures for detainees?
The Military Commissions Act went far beyond eliminating the rights of the remaining detainees at Guantanamo--it potentially reaches all 12 million lawful permanent residents of the United States, as well as visitors to the U.S. Are you willing to re-establish habeas corpus for lawful residents of this country?
Habeas corpus grants a fundamental right to challenge a potentially wrongful detention. It does not require Army personnel to come back from the battlefield to testify. It merely contests whether the wrong person was detained, and it is a fundamental right in Western law. All the government must do to defeat a habeas claim is to demonstrate to a judge that the detainee is being lawfully held. Why are you opposed to exercise of this fundamental right? If the government can't show the person is the right person, wouldn't you want them released?

the only thing i've been hearing about the Rocky Mountain Collegian is your standard neocon outrage about disrepect for values.

i say screw them if they can't take a joke.

No, he did not
Submitted by Fernando on Mon, 09/24/2007 - 2:42pm.
say he believes Israel has a right to exist.

No nation has the "right to exist". Nations are based on violence and chicanery. In the process of creation, others are frequently denied the right to exist, in one way or another. For Palestinians and supporters to accept Israel's right to exist would mean accepting that Israel's displacement and so forth of Palestinians in creating the nation of Israel was right. The diplomatic term is recognizing the existence of Israel. The US insisted that the Palestinians recognize Israel's right to exist, beginning in the 1970s. You will notice that the media always seizes upon this when they are trying to throw bad light on nations in the region which oppose Israel's policies.

What is it that Ahmadenijad says about Israel? That he opposes the concept of Zionism? Israel is a nation based on the racist belief that it exists primarily for Jews, not for former inhabitants of the historical Palestine. He wants a new nation open to all inhabitants. Thus, he is an antisemitic monster.

Israeli Rabbis to Shun Christian Event
By AMY TEIBEL Associated Press Writer
9:12 PM CDT, September 23, 2007

JERUSALEM - Israeli rabbinic authorities have abruptly called on Jews to shun a major Christian tourism event, baffling and upsetting evangelical groups that traditionally have been big supporters of the Jewish state.

More than 6,000 Christians from over 90 nations are expected to arrive in Jerusalem this week to take part in the 28th annual Christian celebration of the weeklong Jewish holiday of Sukkot, or Feast of Tabernacles, according to the event's organizers, the International Christian Embassy Jerusalem.

According to the Old Testament Book of Zechariah, all nations will make pilgrimages to Jerusalem in the messianic era to celebrate Sukkot. Christians have interpreted this to mean that Sukkot is a holiday where Jews welcome non-Jews to join them in celebration in Jerusalem.

Thousands of Christians take part in the celebration annually, as do Israeli lawmakers, government representatives and ordinary Israelis.

But last week the chief rabbinate urged Jews to stay away from the event, saying some of the groups want to convert them to Christianity. Israel has laws against missionary work, and for many here, proselytizing is dangerously close to the forced conversions European Jews endured for centuries.

"According to information that has reached the chief rabbinate, there are participants in this conference who convert Jews to Christianity and perform missionary activity throughout the year," Rabbi Simcha Hacohen Kook, the chief rabbi of Rehovot, who took part in committee discussions of the matter, said on Sunday. "This is against the law, so the chief rabbinate is calling upon Jews not to take part in the conference."

The group's organizers said they were upset by the rabbis' call.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/sns-ap-israel-evangelical...

i'm not sure that it did, but most definitely the callers into cspan were sure of it.

you make a good point that you can't ask a question and then provide your own set of multiple choice answers.

who speaks about their "faith" or brings up "god" in a public forum dealing with international relations or national public policy is full of slimy monkey snot.

Bomber Strikes Shiite-Sunni Meeting
By LAUREN FRAYER

Associated Press Writer

1:45 PM CDT, September 24, 2007

BAQOUBA, Iraq

A suicide bomber struck a reconciliation meeting of Shiite and Sunni tribal leaders and senior provincial officials in Baqouba on Monday, killing at least 15 people, including the city's police chief, security officials said.

A witness said most of the people killed or wounded were in the mosque yard washing their hands or drinking tea after taking a break from the meeting for the iftar banquet, the daily meal to break the sunrise-to-sunset fast during the holy month of Ramadan.

The bombing, which bore the hallmarks of al-Qaida in Iraq, was a challenge to the U.S. strategy of turning members of both Islamic sects against extremists in a bid to duplicate the success in Anbar province to the west of the capital.

The U.S. military has claimed recent success in quelling violence in Baqouba by sending thousands of additional American and Iraqi troops to the area, 35 miles northeast of Baghdad. The meeting of tribal leaders and clerics from both Islamic sects was aimed at reducing sectarian tension and discussing ways to support security forces against insurgents.

The attacker detonated his explosives vest about 8:30 p.m. as guards searched him at the entrance to a Shiite mosque as many meeting participants were waiting to get back into the building.

Baqouba's police chief Brig. Gen. Ali Dalyan and the Diyala provincial operations chief Brig. Gen. Najib al-Taie were near the bomber and were among the 15 killed, according to the security and health officials.

The officials, who spoke on condition of anonymity because they weren't authorized to release the information, also said 28 people were wounded, including several other senior provincial leaders.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/sns-ap-iraq,1,2609210,pri...

Submitted by dan on Mon, 09/24/2007 - 3:43pm.
dan: "...i say screw them if they can't take a joke."
----------------
Why is booking your stand-up act at a prostitution convention a no-brainer?

That meme was started after the 60 minutes interview...Read it and tell me if it's any different than what you heard today and if it truly was "not answering" or "changing the subject".

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/09/21/60minutes/main3286690_page5.sh...

Once the transcript of todays speech is published I think it'll be even clearer how this meme was injected and used by the MSM.

Fernando, religion and politics and international relations are interconnected. If you haven't figured that out by now, then My God, man...

slimey monkey snot? Are we in kindergarten?

Sincerely,

Anonymouse

PS - otherwise, I usually love your posts and appreciate all you do for the blog. But, slimey monkey snot?????

A. Alexander, September 24th, 2007
Republicans, in general, betray us ... all ... and every chance they get. It really doesn't matter what the issue is, Republicans always stand against what is best for the people and the nation, and side with George W. Bush and large corporations. In the name of protecting insurance company's obscene profits, Mister Bush and Congressional Republicans are even willing to deny healthcare to America's least affluent and most vulnerable children.

Remember Mister Bush's supposed "working-family" tax-cuts that actually went to Paris Hilton's family and friends? Remember when Mister Bush and Congressional Republicans allowed big oil and coal companies unfettered access to public lands and -- oops! -- didn't bother to charge the energy companies royalties on the oil they stole from the American taxpayers' property ... then the President and Republicans went even further and gave $12 billion of the taxpayers' money to EXXON and Friends? Remember when George W. Bush made up fake intelligence about Saddam supposedly being involved with 9/11 and possessing "thousands of tons" of weapons of mass destruction ... and Congressional Republicans used the lies as an excuse to send America's children off to fight-and-die in Iraq? All that has been done because Republicans, in general, betray us ... all ... and every chance they get.

Lately, Mister Bush is bragging about his intention of denying health insurance to America's children. Some Republicans are opposed to the President's plan to sentence uninsured children to their disease and treatable illness-caused deaths, but not enough in the House to override the Child Killer-in-Chief's promised veto. The President and "Conservative" Republicans claim that providing health care -- needless death prevention insurance -- to American kids, costs too much. Yes, they said that with a straight face ....

George W. Bush and Congressional Republicans are going to deny children health insurance because, they claim, "it costs too much" ... but they are only too happy to spend $500,000 per-minute, $720 million per-day, and over $12 billion per-month on a war that they started on a "pack of lies." A war, by the way, conducted for the sole purpose of stealing Iraq's oil. "Pshaw," you say? "Liberal conspiracy theory," you say? "Bold-faced lie," you say? Hmmm ... tell that to Allan Greenspan.

http://www.progressivedailybeacon.com/more.php?id=1684

I think anyone
Submitted by Fernando on Mon, 09/24/2007 - 3:48pm.
who speaks about their "faith" or brings up "god" in a public forum dealing with international relations or national public policy is full of slimy monkey snot.
--------------
...and I avoid doing business anywhere that has a fish symbol displayed on the front door...unless they sell fish.

what I really wanted to say was quite vulgar. I'm sorry that you continue to insist that politics and faith must be intertwined for any political progress, especially in this country.

There really shouldn't be a relationship at all. Religion teaches us how to hate each other much more effectively than love one another. As long as that is the case, and people talk about others without giving them the same respect they have for themselves, I will dissent.

And I'll use any words I chose to do so. So there.

PELLEY: What trait do you admire in President Bush?

AHMADINEJAD: Again, I have a very frank tone. I think that President Bush needs to correct his ways.

PELLEY: What do you admire about him?

AHMADEINEJAD: He should respect the American people.

PELLEY: Is there anything? Any trait?

AHMADINEJAD: As an American citizen, tell me what trait do you admire?

PELLEY: Well, Mr. Bush is, without question, a very religious man, for example, as you are. I wonder if there's anything that you've seen in President Bush that you admire.

AHMADEINEJAD: Well, is Mr. Bush a religious man?

PELLEY: Very much so. As you are.

AHMADEINEJAD: What religion, please tell me, tells you as a follower of that religion to occupy another country and kill its people? Please tell me. Does Christianity tell its followers to do that? Judaism, for that matter? Islam, for that matter? What prophet tells you to send 160,000 troops to another country, kill men, women, and children? You just can't wear your religion on your sleeve or just go to church. You should be truthfully religious. Religion tells us all that you should respect the property, the life of different people. Respect human rights. Love your fellow man. And once you hear that a person has been killed, you should be saddened. You shouldn't sit in a room, a dark room, and hatch plots. And because of your plots, many thousands of people are killed. Having said that, we respect the American people. And because of our respect for the American people, we respectfully talk with President Bush. We have a respectful tone. But having said that, I don't think that that is a good definition of religion. Religion is love for your fellow man, brotherhood, telling the truth.

What's Your News IQ?
To find out, we invite you to take our UPDATED quiz about prominent people and major events in the news -- then see how you did in comparison with 1,005 randomly sampled adults asked the same questions in a recent national survey conducted by the Pew Research Center. You'll also be able to compare your News IQ with the average scores of men and women; with college graduates as well as those who didn't attend college; with people who are your age as well as with younger and older Americans. Are you more news-savvy than the average American? Here's your chance to find out. Take the quiz

http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?t=yn7k8ecab.0.6yw7y5bab.r5mmtrbab.31852&ts=S0275&p...

all elements are fused within solar chambers and that gas turns into dust and planets and hearts.

Your heart, my heart, and Ahmadeinejad's all have elements created from a common source. We really have too much in common to annihilate the precious differences between us all.

Those differences should be held up and cherished more than any other object of value. Religion has a big problem with that.

If anyone doesn't get 100% they haven't read this blog!

Fernando, I do not insist. I am saying that it necessarily does. You can take a priest and don him with a judge's robe, and he will still be a priest. We have a nation here where religion plays a big role in the way people think and the way they vote.

It's sociology, my friend. Religion is a natural part of our lives, be we Christian, Muslim, Hindu, Natural Indian, Buddhist, etc., we all believe in something that gives us hope in dark tunnels.

You must be able to define the people you wish to influence. Step inside their shoes and take a good look at their philosophies and beliefs. If you are blind to their basic make-up, you will fail.

That's all I'm saying.

Here's Your Score: You correctly answered 12 of the 12 possible questions along with approximately 6% of the public. You did better than 94% of the general public.

HAH!...won't be a big deal around here but still...HAH!

You did better than 94% of the general public. Scary, isn't it?

I'd add that religions are intended to do other things...like teaching empathy, ethics...How they get used is how anything will get used by the sociopathic amongst us...

Btw...I'm against organized religions myself because they can and are all too often used in the wrong way...but I'm not against religion when it sticks to intended use...I'm also an athiest so take it how you will.

trust me. I understand. And civilizations have been cursed with that made up shackle for millennium. People insist it's a requirement to believe that is the only structure.

If I want hope in dark tunnels I turn to science not voodoo. That always gives me satisfactory truths to live by. If all insisted on leaving those ancient artifacts where they belong (in history books), then atheists wouldn't have to always bear the effects of ignorance and hatred that religion poisons us with - IN MY OPINION.

I'm not trying to be offensive, but how many thousands of years do those of us who don't share that need for a crutch need to endure the torture of those who have a divine faith? How long would you like to endure the affliction of those constraints from others if you didn't have that limitation?

to think that people can be actually dumber than me?...hell yes, it's scary.

blog classic definition of flawed thinking from the imperial elites.

i give it a thumbs (or any other suitable member) up!

and yet we wore polyester pant suits while disco diving in the 70's.

incontrovertible evidence that god has a sense of humor.

THE PRESIDENT OF IRAN SPEAKS TO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE ON CBS: COMMENTARY

It is shocking because it is hard to imagine that this took place on an American television station. This was an interrogation not a interview. If American media treats the President of a Country with so little respect, imagine how they treat a common man! Never have I seen a newscaster with so much imbedded arrogance. I was speechless. CBS does not speak for me.

Hillary Clinton's First South Carolina Radio Ad Targets Black Women

24 Sep 2007 02:31 pm

Sen. Hillary Clinton is up with a radio ad in South Carolina today, her first. A few things of note:

## It's targeted at African American women. She purchased 140 gross ratings points in Florence, 165 points in Chucktown, 400 in the capital of Columbia, and 180 in Greenville. It's estimated to have cost the campaign about $40,000.

## The ad references the Corridor of Shame, an underfunded, underperforming, largely minority stretch of rural school districts along I-95 in South Carolina.

## It keeps with the "Invisibles" theme that Clinton has employed in the early primary states. October is Invisibles month for the Clinton campaign, so expect to hear a lot more from Clinton on the subject.

## In South Carolina, undecided black women will probably determine the outcome of the primary. A recent poll of the African American electorate in South Carolina suggests that Clinton may be losing some ground to Obama.

What's this "we" thing?...

Hey,

Two of my favorite bloggers, Jane Hamsher and Matt Stoller, are leading the fight online to force our Democratic leadership in the Senate in the right direction.

In 2006, the American people elected a new Congress to end the occupation of Iraq.

Almost a year later, with the overwhelming public sentiment in favor of ending the war, Democratic leadership has actually found a way to LOSE ground in the Senate.

After we expressed disappointment over the last blank-check, we were told to wait until "Magical September" -- and now that it's here, it appears George Bush isn't the only one without a plan or the desire to get us out of Iraq, Democratic Leadership is right there with him.

Vote in the poll linked below and weigh in on what WE can do to move Democratic leadership in the right direction.

http://action.openleft.com/page/s/nextsteps

"Here's Your Score: You correctly answered 11 out of the 12 possible questions, which means you did better on the quiz than 85% of the general public."

And I don't read the paper, nor do I get to see much news.

Oh my gosh. See how you guys are educating me?

Is the Bush administration behind the bombings in Iran?

Two bombings this week in Zahedan in southeastern Iran are the latest in a series of incidents involving armed opposition groups based among the country’s ethnic minorities. The most recent attacks again raise questions about the activities of the US military and CIA inside Iran as the Bush administration intensifies its preparations for war.

that's not what I think they are intended to do. I believe your assumption to be a veil to conceal mechanism to control the territory and resources.

Constantine certainly didn't install Christianity to teach anything. He installed Christianity because the gods of his predecessors had eventually let them down in battle.

Washington’s proxy war inside Kurdish Iran

Anonymouse

I'm sorry I missed him taking a break to tell him so...

My heart feels sad for him missing Rose.

to be a veil to conceal mechanism to control the territory and resources."

and I repeat...

How they get used is how anything will get used by the sociopathic amongst us...

Instead of religions let's use that grand idea of a free press and see how that's worked out...

Is how the press is being used make it intrinsically evil?

Rice’s Waning Influence: Networks Reject Secretary Of State As Sunday Show Guest
Over the past two years, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice has been on the Sunday talk shows 30 times, making her the most second frequent guest after Sen. Joe Biden (D-DE).

But that may be changing. In his Washington Post column, Howard Kurtz reveals that Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice is no longer a “prize catch” for the Sunday talk shows. She was recently turned down by both CBS and NBC:

The secretary of state has always been considered a prize catch for the Sunday talk shows. But when the White House offered Condoleezza Rice for appearances eight days ago, after a week focused on Iraq, two programs took the unusual step of turning her down.

Executives at CBS and NBC say Rice no longer seems to be a key player on the war and that her cautious style makes her a frustrating guest.

“I expected we’d just get a repetition of the administration’s talking points, which had already been well circulated,” says Bob Schieffer, host of CBS’s “Face the Nation,” who questioned two senators instead. “We’d had a whole week of that with General Petraeus and President Bush.”

Television media aren’t the only ones uninterested in Rice. A few months ago, every single major newspaper turned it down an op-ed by Rice on Lebanon. Price Floyd, formerly the State Department’s director of media affairs, recounted that the piece was filled glowing references to President Bush’s wise leadership and “read like a campaign document.”

Recent reports indicate that Rice’s influence within the White House is also waning, giving way to the more extreme policies of Cheney and his allies. A Newsweek article in June found that Cheney’s national-security team had “been actively challenging Rice’s Iran strategy in recent months.” In April, Rice advocated that five members of the Iran Revolutionary Guard be freed from captivity, but she was overruled after Cheney “made the firmest case for keeping them.”

These reports contrast when Rice first became Secretary of State. The media gushingly predicted she would succeed because she and Bush “know each other so well they have conversations based on body language” and speculated that she may even run for president in 2008.

This past Sunday, none of the five network talk shows turned down Sen. Hillary Clinton (D-NY), who appeared on ABC, CBS, CNN, NBC, and Fox.

http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/24/rice-influence/

who do the bombing serve?...

US backing 'secret war' against Iran?

The US government has been secretly supporting a Pakistani militant group that has staged a series of deadly attacks against Iran, ABC News reported, citing unnamed US and Pakistani intelligence sources.

Ahmadinejad denies existence of gays in Iran. In his speech at Columbia University today, Iran President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad was asked about the treatment of gays in Iran. Ahmadinejad responded, “In Iran, we dont have homosexuals like in your country. We don’t have that in our country. In Iran, we do not have this phenomenon. I don’t know who’s told you we have it.” Watch it:

“Some international gay rights groups believe that more than 4,000 lesbians and gay men have been executed since the Ayatollahs seized power in 1979,” notes 365gay.com.

http://www.365gay.com/Newscon07/09/092407iran.htm

there's so many government workers they seem to be able to stir up shit all over the fucking planet...

What a shocker...

LOL, ToniD! :D

FWIW, nobody watches Canadian Idol...it's hosted by the son of a former Tory PM :(

I've never seen "ET Canada" or "Canada's next Top Model," but I think we can safely assume they're as crappy as their USian predecessors, eh? ;)

GDK
Hope & Onions

For those of you willing to defile your holy temples with cathode rays, Dennis Kucinich will be on Jay Leno tonight and Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad will be on Charlie Rose.

I find television programming information on:

http://www.titantv.com/

If anyone knows of a better resource, I'm all (rabbit) ears.

NY lawmakers threaten to punish Columbia over speech. State and city lawmakers in New York are threatening to punish Columbia University for hosting Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, who spoke at the Ivy League university earlier this afternoon, by potentially “withholding public funds from the school“:

“[Columbia President Lee] Bollinger made a big mistake, and there should be consequences for him for making that decision,” the chairman of the New York City Council’s Finance Committee, David Weprin, said in an interview. “We should look at everything involving Columbia, whether it be capital projects, city and state, or other related things that we do in the city for them,” he said. […]

“It’s not going to go away just because this episode ends. Columbia University has to know … that they will be penalized,” an assemblyman of Brooklyn, Dov Hikind, who also attended the rally, said.

http://www.nysun.com/article/63232

“Is there anyone who fails to see how dangerous and improper this is — not to mention unconstitutional — that government officials threaten and punish universities for hosting speakers whom the officials dislike?,” comments Glenn Greenwald.

http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2007/09/24/ahmadinejad/index.html...

Bush: We Can’t Spend $22 Billion On America Because We Need $200 Billion For Iraq War »
The Democratic leadership in Congress is set to pass a host of domestic funding bills that would exceed Bush’s request by $22 billion. The extra funding would help go towards veterans health care, infrastructure improvements, education, and other domestic priorities.

Speaking to business leaders at a White House event this morning, Bush railed against the relatively modest increase in spending, arguing that $22 billion is “a lot of money”:

Some in Congress will tell you that $22 billion is not a lot of money. As business leaders, you know better. As a matter of fact, $22 billion is larger than the annual revenues of most Fortune 500 companies. The $22 billion is only for the first year. With every passing year the number gets bigger and bigger, and so over the next five years the increase in federal spending would add up to $205 billion.

Watch it: (at link)

Bush warned that spending increases, which could add up to over $200 billion over five years, would be “taking money out of the pocket” of Americans who need to “pay their mortgages or pay for their children going to college.” Unfortunately, Bush failed to appreciate the irony in his remarks.

While complaining of modest spending increases on much-needed domestic funding priorities, Bush is far less concerned about the impact of spending $200 billion in the next year alone on a disastrous war in Iraq:

President Bush plans to ask lawmakers next week to approve another massive spending measure — totaling nearly $200 billion — to fund the war through next year, Pentagon officials said.

It shouldn’t take a “CEO President” to figure out that $200 billion is greater than $22 billion.

http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/24/bush-priorities/

Fernando, Nobody, the beautiful thing about different ideas getting heard, is that this is what our Constitution allows. You can disagree, you can say they should not exist. The fact that they do is something you cannot change.

It takes all kinds to make the world go 'round, right?

As for free press and the way it is getting manipulated, take a look at youtube as an example. It is now being used by people like Hollywood Records to promote their new wares, and packaged to look like the new kid on the block so that kids will bite. Is this manipulation? Sure. But it's free and available for all of us to use at will. Does that make it evil?

I am a Christian. I am not a Republican. I believe that my input is needed at my church where prominent Republican leaders from my region worship, so that they can hear, discuss and, yes, even pray over whether their idealogies are correct.

Testing of theories and sharing of ideas. Sounds downright democratic to me.

GOP Rep. Demands Hard-Hitting Investigation into MoveOn/Times Ad
"It is time for The New York Times to answer publicly, on the record, and under oath for its conduct," says Rep. Tom Davis (R-VA) in a letter to Oversight Committee chair Henry Waxman.

http://tpmelectioncentral.com/2007/09/gop_congressman_calls_for_hearings...

Rudy Again Says That Anti-Petraeus-Type Speech "Should Not Be Allowed"
By Greg Sargent - September 24, 2007, 2:36PM
Last week we reported that Rudy told an audience of National Rifle Association Members that "we should not allow" political speech like the MoveOn ad criticizing General Petraeus. A bunch of people wondered what Rudy meant by this -- whether he supports legal curbs on such types of speech about members of the military, for instance.

Well, it turns out this isn't the first time he's made this suggestion. Brendan Nyhan has unearthed another example of this -- an appearance by Rudy on Sean Hannity's radio show on Sept. 13, where he attacked Hillary for questioning Petraeus' credibility:

This is being done purely for political campaign strategy. It's a calculated political campaign strategy. You should not be allowed to malign someone's reputation unfairly just because you think it's good for your campaign.
In isolation, these sorts of comments probably wouldn't be noteworthy. But as Nyhan points out, Rudy has had an extremely contentious relationship with the First Amendment over the years, making it more than fair game to ask Rudy for clarification as to what he really thinks about these issues. Particularly since his campaign is declining to disavow such remarks.

http://tpmelectioncentral.com/2007/09/_rudy_again_says_that_people_shoul...

did anybody catch bill mahers discussion about being a rationalist. i had not heard that phrase before but i find it fits my attitude fairly well. its good to know that 1 out of 5 people is a rationalist.

Vitter Earmarks Federal Funds for Anti-Evolution Group
Sen. David Vitter (R-LA) has earmarked $100,000 for a Louisiana group that advocates stopping the teaching of evolution in public schools, the Times-Picayune reports. Vitter has close ties to the group, the Louisiana Family Forum (insert joke about Vitter and DC Madam here), which calls evolution a "dangerous" theory. The spending bill containing the earmark is pending before the Senate.

--David Kurtz

http://blog.nola.com/times-picayune/2007/09/vitter_earmarked_federal_mon...

Don't Miss That Meme
As you can see in our feature story over on the right, the White House's new line is that Barack Obama may be too "intellectually lazy" to run a serious presidential campaign let alone be President of the United States.

But don't think this allusion to generations of stereotypes about black men was just some stray comment.

The RNC just shot off an email building on the slur. With the headline "Razzle Dazzle", the email continues the theme that Obama is just another black fancy-pants with a slick smile and nice turn of phrase but either without the candle-power or stick-to-it-iveness to actually get things done.

"Chicago Star Obama Continues His All Show, No Substance Campaign With Event On Broadway," the email begins.

What to expect next out of the RNC? Obama would be a better singer and tap dancer than president?

--Josh Marshall

http://tpmelectioncentral.com/2007/09/oh_boy_the_white_house_calls_obama...

only because the dems caved on telling the republicans to stuff it. as long as they think this has legs they will push. there is no sense of making their point and MOVING ON. and that's why the dems were wrong, even if randi disagrees.

again their hypocrisy rises to the top. just remember max cleland, swiftboats, and purple bandaids.

Anonymouse but make sure you have the facts about things when you hear anyone preach.

Medieval Sourcebook link

Larry Johnson reads the long piece in the Sunday Washington Post on those missing nukes and has a succinct response: Simple error, my ass.

--David Kurtz

http://www.tpmcafe.com/blog/coffeehouse/2007/sep/24/simple_error_my_ass

IRS Drops Case Against Liberal Church
From the LA Times:

The Internal Revenue Service has told a prominent Pasadena church that it has ended its lengthy investigation into a 2004 antiwar sermon, church leaders said Sunday.
But the agency wrote in its letter to All Saints Episcopal Church that officials still considered the sermon to have been illegal, prompting the church to seek clarification, a corrected record and an apology from the IRS, the church's rector told standing-room-only crowds of parishioners at Sunday's services.

The church also has asked the Treasury Department, which oversees the IRS, to investigate allegations that officials from the Justice Department had become involved in the matter, raising concerns that the investigation was politically motivated.

This IRS investigation was launched way back in June 2005, but suddenly ramped up just before the 2006 mid-term elections. Now, no action from the IRS, just an ominous warning without apparent foundation. More here on the history of this odd case.

--David Kurtz

http://taxprof.typepad.com/taxprof_blog/2007/09/irs-drops-inves.html

HP to expand Linux PC offerings to other countries; US a "real possibility"
By Ryan Paul | Published: September 24, 2007 - 01:03AM CT

Late last month, hardware vendor HP announced plans to offer desktop computers in Australia with Red Hat Linux, OpenOffice.org, and Firefox installed. Now the company has confirmed that it is expanding this program to other parts of the world. Moreover, sources close to the company tell Ars Technica that expanded Linux offerings will also be coming to the US. Our source says that it is a "real possibility" that HP will counter Dell's limited embrace of Linux "sooner rather than later," so long as pilot programs proceed as planned.

Like many other mainstream hardware vendors, HP already provides relatively broad Linux server support for a number of distributions, including community-driven distributions like Debian. The company also certifies Red Hat and SUSE Enterprise Linux 10 for its desktop computers but has only recently started to evaluate the advantages of offering Linux preinstallation options on a large scale. The current pilot program in Australia is only the first of several pilots planned, but HP has not yet said what countries it plans to expand to. The question has been: when would HP take its Linux efforts and apply them to the US?

On the record, the company is quiet. Several attempts to verify our insider information with HP were not answered by press time (and we've waited four days). The company has publicly stated that it is finding it difficult to assess the real demand for Linux in many markets, however, with HP director of business PC product marketing Brian Schmitz saying that demand for Linux is "really hard to gauge. There's always a lot of noise around Linux but the demand isn't there." Schmitz's comments were reported by ChannelWeb, which reported on the multi-nation pilot expansion last week. "We have seen interest in certain parts of the world," Schmitz said then. "We're going to try some things in other countries with pre-loaded Linux."

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20070924-hp-to-expand-linux-pc-offe...

I'm not sure how my previous statements are addressed by your post...I can find little to disagree with and I'm known for being disagreeable...

I'd reiterate my statement that religion is intended to teach positive things, and further clarify that it is all too often misused...

As an athiest I can assure you that self identifying as such all too often violent and angry reaction...I'm assumed to be without ethic and more and yet studies show that athiests and their self taught moral systems tend to be less abusive of others...In fact live closer to the paragons of behavior that most religions teach us to be...When you have no easy out of repentence and mortality, well then you just try to make the most out of it...

Religion has longer been manipulated for ill intent than the press...but anything that seeks to teach or alter human behavior will be used by those that wish to dictate the terms of that behavior...

Question everything...and that's part of the problem with religion...the requirement of not questioning or "faith"...It makes it much too easy to control others and too much of a temptation for those that would do so...

Will religion go away?...doubtful...Should it?...no, but it definitely needs some work.

Department of Veterans Affairs Reports 73 Thousand U.S. Gulf War Deaths

How come the government numbers of 3,777 as of 9/7/7 are so low? The answer is simple, the government does not want the 73,000 dead to be compared to the 55,000 U.S. soldiers killed in Vietnam Iraq = Vietnam. What the government is doing is only counting the soldiers that die in action before they can get them into a helicopter or ambulance. Any soldier who is shot but they get into a helicopter before he dies is not counted.

[Edited to bring to the end of the thread again]

i had to run an errand so i was catching the rerun of big eddie. a person called in and claims that the bush administration has outsourced translation of documents to a company run / owned by a far right neocon and that same company intentionally translates things like the iranian president using words which cast him in the worst possible light.

historically its been assumed that translations tend to be neutral but it looks like that is not the case anymore...

i have nothing to collaborate the story.

BrilliantatBreakfast for making it on C&L's Blog round up today!

By Kevin Johnson, USA TODAY
WASHINGTON — Propelled by increases in robbery and murder, violent crime nationwide rose for the second consecutive year in 2006, according to the FBI's annual crime report, released Monday.
Murder rose by nearly 2% last year and robbery increased 7% as violence re-emerged as a central issue in several large cities following more than a decade of declining crime.

The FBI report, among the most reliable national measures of crime, closely tracks with a survey of 56 U.S. cities published earlier this year by the Police Executive Research Forum, an advocacy group.

THE REPORT: Read the 2006 FBI Uniform Crime Report

That survey showed a nearly 3% increase in murder and a 6.5% jump in robbery.

FIND MORE STORIES IN: Federal Bureau of Investigation
According to the FBI report, the 17,034 murders nationwide in 2006 were the most in a decade.

The number still does not come close to the 24,703 killings recorded in 1991, when crime was rampant in many parts of the nation.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2007-09-24-crime_N.htm?csp=34

Chafee Unlikely to Make Bid for Governor
Charlie Bakst in the Providence Journal on former Sen. Lincoln Chafee:

"I thought Chafee might try in 2010 for the governorship his late father, John, held in the 1960s and thus keep the seat Republican. But now comes word that the liberal Chafee, isolated within the national party, has become an independent... He tells me he’s 'unlikely' to run for governor and that if he does try for that post, or for mayor of Providence, where he now lives, he won’t return to GOP ranks to do it."

http://politicalwire.com/archives/2007/09/24/chafee_unlikely_to_make_bid...

Extra Bonus Quote of the Day
"The Republican Party has won two elections on the issue of fear and terrorism. It's going to try again."

-- Sen Chuck Hagel (R-NE), quoted by the Los Angeles Times, bucking his fellow Republicans on the closing of the U.S. detention facility at Guantanamo Bay.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-gitmo24sep24,0,3276...

Obama Gets Big Iowa Endorsement
Former Iowa Democratic Party Chairman Gordon Fischer endorsed Sen. Barack Obama today, citing his electability and potential a "change agent."

"The word 'change' gets thrown around a lot, but Obama is the kind of candidate who won't just change who lives in the White House; he'll change the divisive, special-interest driven politics that has blocked progress on important issues like health care, energy, and education for decades. Obama truly offers the kind of fundamental change Iowans want and our country needs."

http://politicalwire.com/archives/2007/09/24/obama_gets_big_iowa_endorse...

Rice sees no US,
Iran talks on Iraq soon

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The United States does not plan fresh U.S.-Iranian talks on how to stabilize Iraq any time soon but will leave open the possibility for such discussions, U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice said on Monday.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070924/ts_nm/iraq_iran_rice_dc;_ylt=AiEYTsy...

Like early Islam, Christian Reformation was bloody and traumatic

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We also have a hard time remembering the religious fanaticism in our own history. Westerners now talk blithely about the need for a “reformation” in Islam, apparently oblivious to how bloody and traumatic the Christian Reformation actually was.

http://www.salon.com/books/review/2007/09/24/stillborn_god/index_np.html

Whaaaa....?

He demands "The Times" be under oath over a paid advertisement?

So, now they're having a crisis of conscience about sworn testimony?

These people are bat-shit-crazy-fascists. There's no other explanation. To them, "under oath" only applies to political adversaries.

Fernando, dan, Anonymouse, et al,

I cannot remember where I heard/read the following logic but I know that it was from a Freethinker or an atheist or an agnostic or a non-believer of some sort.

It states that atheists (non-believers) and the faithful/spiritual (believers) are more in agreement than not in agreement. Of the thousands of superstitions/beliefs-of-faith, the believer believes in one. The non-believer believes in none.

The non-believer and the believer share disbelief in the remaining thousands of superstitions/beliefs.

Said another way; the believer rejects all beliefs save one while the non-believer rejects the same beliefs plus one, therefore the believer is only fractionally removed from being a non-believer.

It’s Giuliani Time
By Lane Hudson on Mon Sep 24, 2007 at 12:30 pm
Rudy Giuliani is a hypocrite who thinks he should live by rules different than others. He attacked MoveOn.org and the New York Times for the rate charged for a newspaper ad. Promptly, he ran an ad in response and paid….wait for it….the SAME amount.

Since the NYT says it was a mistake that they were charged the lower amount, MoveOn promptly paid the difference in an ‘abundance of caution’. Rudy refuses to.

The wingnuts filed an FEC complaint against MoveOn and the NYT, but didn’t include Rudy. That oversight has now been corrected:

General Counsel
Federal Election Commission
999 E. Street, NW
Washington, DC 20463

Dear Counsel:

This is a formal complaint against the Rudy Giuliani Presidential Committee, Inc. for the receipt of corporate soft money contribution in excess of the limits established by the Federal Elections Campaign Act of 1971 and the Bipartisan Campaign Reform Act of 2002. The information in this complaint is derived from publicly available reports on the internet and falls under 2 U.S.C. 441 B and 11 CFR S 114.2.

In response to an advertisement purchased by Moveon.org Political Action on September 19, 2007, the Giuliani Campaign purchased an advertisement to run in the September 14 publication of the New York Times. Both Moveon.org Political Action and the Giuliani Campaign paid $64,575 for their respective ads. This ad quote is known as the ’standby rate’ because the day of publication and its placement are not guaranteed.

In a September 23, 2007 newspaper column, Public Editor of the New York Times, Clark Hoyt, admitted that the New York Times made a mistake in charging MoveOn.org the standby rate:

Catherine Mathis, vice president of corporate communications for The Times, said, “We made a mistake.” She said the advertising representative failed to make it clear that for that rate The Times could not guarantee the Monday placement but left MoveOn.org with the understanding that the ad would run then. She added, “That was contrary to our policies.”

MoveOn.org responded to the column by saying this on September 23:

Now that the Times has revealed this mistake for the first time, and while we believe that the $142,083 figure is above the market rate paid by most organizations, out of an abundance of caution we have decided to pay that rate for this ad. We will therefore wire the $77,083 difference to the Times…

In the same column, Mr. Hoyt has this to say about the advertisement purchased by Mr. Giuliani:

In the fallout from the ad, Rudolph Giuliani, the former New York mayor and a Republican presidential candidate, demanded space in the following Friday’s Times to answer MoveOn.org. He got it — and at the same $64,575 rate that MoveOn.org paid.

According to the New York Times’ own policy, Mr. Giuliani should have paid the fixed-date rate instead of the standby rate. Therefore, the difference, $77,083 is an in-kind corporate contribution, which far exceeds the limits allowed by law. Now that he has knowledge that his campaign is in receipt of an illegal $77,083 contribution from the New York Times, it is incumbent on Mr. Giuliani to repay the difference. If he does not, that is not just a violation of the law but a betrayal of the public trust at a time when Americans want integrity from our leaders.

When Mr. Giuliani’s campaign was called on to pay the difference, therefore avoiding a violation of law, his campaign declined to do so.

Respectfully submitted,

Lane Hudson

http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/09/24/its-giuliani-time/

As tempted as I am to go into the grand unified theory of religion...That being that all religions are intrinsically one with a few nonessential frills attached and that even not believing is a religion, I'll just skip the whole damned thing...

Hunter: I Will Try To ‘Cut Off Funds To Columbia University’ Because Of Ahmadinejad Speech
Earlier today, Rep. Duncan Hunter (R-CA) said in a statement that if Columbia University President Lee Bollinger “follows through with this hosting of the leader of Iran, I will move in Congress to cut off every single type of Federal Funding to Columbia University.”

Introduced as a “petty and cruel dictator” by Bollinger, Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad did indeed speak at the Ivy League university, where he outlandishly claimed that there are no gay men or women in Iran.

Appearing on Fox News’ Your World with Neil Cavuto after the speech, Hunter said that he plans to follow through on his threat and will now “initiate legislation, and try to get as many people as can see it my way, to cut off funds to Columbia University.” Watch it:

Hunter is not the only lawmaker looking to punish Columbia and Bollinger for hosting a speaker whom they dislike. The New York Sun reports today that state and city lawmakers in New York are considering punitively withholding public funds from the school as well.

Glenn Greenwald asked:

Is there anyone who fails to see how dangerous and improper this is — not to mention unconstitutional — that government officials threaten and punish universities for hosting speakers whom the officials dislike?

Even President Bush doesn’t think Columbia should be punished for hosting Ahmadinejad, telling Fox News today that he’s “not sure” he would “offer the same invitation,” but that America is “confident enough to let a person express his views.” Everyone…except a host of right-wingers who cower when faced with the “views” of people they dislike.

http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/24/hunter-columbia-funding/

Subbing for Malloy Tonight
Submitted by SEDER on Mon, 09/24/2007 - 6:04pm.

I'll be filling in for the great Mike Malloy at 9pm est.. listen here

Tomorrow- Marc Maron and I do our Vidcast 11am here.
Post new comment--

http://www.samsedershow.com/node/1340

Fox bangs Iran war drums. In an interview with Newt Gingrich today on Fox News, The Big Story With John Gibson moved away from the shot of Gingrich and the interviewer to display a screenshot stating, “Is war the only way to stop Mahmoud?”:

Congratulations
Submitted by Fernando on Mon, 09/24/2007 - 5:34pm.
BrilliantatBreakfast for making it on C&L's Blog round up today!

Brava <<< APPLAUSE >>> :NOD: ;)

Academic Freedom Under Attack: Legislators Threaten to Punish Columbia for Ahmadinejad Speech

With today’s speech by Iranian president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, legislators are threatening to pull state funds unless Columbia engages in self-censorship and bars the speech. Columbia has not been a particularly reliable first amendment advocate in the past. In a shocking display of anti-free speech conduct, students shutdown a speech by the head of an anti-immigration movement and did not have punishment. The speaker was later disinvited by the student organization. Regardless of the value of the Minuteman activities, the Columbia students violated a core principle of free speech and should have been (at a minimum) suspended for a year from the campus. Columbia failed to take action, but it is now right to stand by its decision. Ahmadinejad is an odious, hateful, and seemingly unbalanced man. However, his views carry great sway in the Middle East. Universities are places for the free debate of ideas, including his. These legislators benefit from a state with some of the finest universities in the world. Rather than support those universities, they want to invade the protected area of academic freedom and turn campuses into the same fearful and politicized environment as current American politics.

For full story, click here

http://www.nysun.com/article/63232

Atheist student’s home attacked by poor-spelling religious extremists

While an atheist soldier litigates a claim of discrimination by the military (discussed below), an atheist high school student found her home vandalized for challenging “God Bless America” as an appropriate song for her school. The daughter of atheist activist Rob Sherman. The student’s Buffalo Grove home was hit by eggs and graffiti with such words as “JESSUS.”

Enjoy your fishing trip & your blog vacation. I'll try to keep crankie occupied with my ankle-biting comments in your stead.

Hurry back! I value your opinion & your perspective.

*tips hat*

"That being that all religions are intrinsically one with a few nonessential frills attached and that even not believing is a religion, I'll just skip the whole damned thing..."

==

As I was shopping recently at a store which had biblical items on one set of shelves, next to mystical items on the next set of shelves, and thought to myself that those who 'believed' would purchase this thing while those who 'didn't' would likely purchase that thing..and that either way the shopowner would get a sale; and as I was wondering at the degrees of difference between the buyers, yesterday my mind was running along the same lines as what you stated above.

Scarey. We agree.

Was it Karl Marx who once said that 'religion is the opium of the masses.' ??

Anonymouse

cool...I just found a copy of Uppity Women of Medievel Times on the Free Book shelf...

High health care costs lead to strike at GM. Today, the United Auto Workers union announced they would launch a nationwide-strike, the first in 37 years, against General Motors over job security and benefits, as GM has sought to cut costs. Markos links the strike to GM’s astronomical health care costs, noting that the company spent $5.2 billion on health care in 2005. GM officials have acknowledged the need to address health care costs:

“Failing to address the health care crisis would be the worst kind of procrastination,” [General Motors Corp. chairman and chief executive G. Richard] Wagoner said, “the kind that places our children and our grandchildren at risk and threatens the health and global competitiveness of our nation’s economy.” […]

“GM is the canary in the coal mine for Medicare and everyone else,” said Sean P. McAlinden, chief economist at the nonprofit Center for Automotive Research. “There are many, many more companies out there in trouble because of health care costs than just the auto, steel and airline industries.”

Kos and Digby suggest that perhaps the strike could “drive the nation closer to universal health care.” More on the strike here.

http://thinkprogress.org/2007/09/24/high-health-care-costs-lead-to-strik...

with pictures...

*

Growing Up Gonzo

HST

Prosecutor: Craig's Withdrawal Of Guilty Plea Is "Politicking"
By Greg Sargent - September 24, 2007, 5:43PM
Breaking: A development in the Larry Craig case!

A prosecutor on the case has now filed papers in response to Craig's request to withdraw his guilty plea in the "wide stance" scandal. The prosecutor, Christopher Renz, makes a rather straightforward point: Craig didn't move to withdraw this plea until, you know, it became public:

Craig clearly "had hoped that he could plead guilty and that the plea would not be discovered by the media or public," Renz wrote. "The defendant chose to plead guilty and consciously took that risk. The defendant's current pursuit of withdrawal of his guilty plea is reactionary, calculated and political."
Not sure how one can argue with this.

http://tpmelectioncentral.com/2007/09/prosecutor_craigs_withdrawal_of_gu...

A prosecutor on the case has now filed papers in response to Craig's request to withdraw his guilty plea in the "wide stance" scandal. The prosecutor, Christopher Renz, makes a rather straightforward point: Craig didn't move to withdraw this plea until, you know, it became public:

I say, give the guy a break. He's done, anyway.

Private Wealth and Political Alienation
Posted September 24, 2007 | 05:44 PM (EST)

Polling data make clear that there is a gaping disconnect between the American people and their trust in this country's political system. The United States retains the appearance of a democracy, but its substance has been steadily diminished. Private wealth in politics has alienated the electorate and has imposed a conservative agenda on the country.

That conclusion emerges from a review of surveys undertaken over more than a fifty year period by The American National Elections Studies (ANES) a well-respected research organization. The long term trend toward alienation is unmistakable.

Source: The American National Election Studies.

As reported in Table 1, almost 60 percent of those surveyed between 1992 and 2000 believed that public officials did not care what people thought, up from 29 percent in 1952. During the 1990s almost 70 percent believed that the government was run for a few big interests rather than for the benefit of all, up from 36 percent in the 1960s; and in the 1990s, 45 percent believed that people do not have a say in what the government does, an increase from the 29 percent registered in the 1950s. In a reaction to 9/11 this unfavorable trend was temporarily reversed. But in 2004, it resumed, with big increases registered in these measures of political alienation. In 2004 roughly half the population was skeptical about the government's commitment to serve the people, a level far higher than the less than one third that reported such skepticism fifty years earlier.

This problem of political estrangement is not confined to a specific party. Since 1978 the ANES has computed a "thermometer" showing that for both major political parties the "average feeling" in 2004 was substantially lower than in the past. The Democrat's score of 58 compares with the peak it achieved in 1986 of 63; the Republican score of 54 represented a decline from 59 it registered in 1988.

Why did this happen? Figure 1 below shows that the period of increasing political cynicism occurred during the very years in which there was a huge increase in the role of private money in the political process. The big jump in political expenses was initiated in the 1980 electoral cycle. Private political contributions were 50 percent higher (in constant prices) in 1980 than in 1976. They increased by another 19 percent between 1980 and 1984, and by 32 percent during the next four years. The level of private political donations in 1988 was almost three times that of 1976.

Even as the amount of private money in politics was increasing, the percentage of the American people who made private political contributions remained very small. The ANES surveys indicate that a high water mark in this regard occurred in 1976 when 16 percent of the population reported that they had made at least a token political donation. Thereafter there was a retreat. In 1984 the ANES reported that 8 percent of the population contributed to political war chests. That figure stood at only 9 percent in 1988.

These then were the years in which the American political process was transformed. While the role of private donations increased, the population base from which these funds were raised narrowed. Politics had become the domain of the rich.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jay-mandle/private-wealth-and-politi_b_657...

We've been so busy sobbing over our health insurance that we forgot about our home owners insurance. I tried paying mine today and I was told the price got a bit higher. Is the state gonna take every penny from us in every possible way? They tried through health insurance and failed. Now this. What's next?

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